Illinois Concealed Carry Ban Overturned by 7th Circuit in THEE RANT Forum

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Illinois Concealed Carry Ban Overturned by 7th Circuit

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Chicago PD NorthSide	Illinois Concealed Carry Ban Overturned by 7th Circuit		Lead	[-]
Posts: 250 Dec 11 12 6:39 PM	Tags : nyc, chicago, copy, concealed, carry Remove this ad HALLELUJAH! In a 2-1 decision published today by the United States Court of Appeals for the 7th Circuit, Illinois (the only state in the Union banning concealed carry) has ruled that responsible, law-abiding citizens may now carry a concealed weapon for self-defense in the State of Illinois, including violent crime-ridden Chicago, Crook County. See http://www.ca7.uscourts.gov/tmp/NY0ZLOKB.pdf If the above link fails, try http://cbschicago.files.wordpress.com/2012/12/concealed-carry.pdf Note that in the last 2 pages of this decision, dissenting Judge Ann C. Williams specifically cites concealed carry in New York City. Edited 2 times by Chicago PD NorthSide Dec 19 12 1:24 PM.
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5andOUT		#1	[url]	[-]
Posts: 6137 Dec 11 12 7:32 PM	See the earlier threads. Not over by a longshot. You do not need a parachute to skydive. You only need a parachute to skydive twice.
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BROOM		#2	[url]	[-]
Posts: 9038 Dec 11 12 7:35 PM	Chicago, Did that ban prohibit ret. cops also? I wouldn't be surprised!
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5andOUT		#3	[url]	[-]
Posts: 6137 Dec 11 12 7:36 PM	BROOM wrote: Chicago, Did that ban prohibit ret. cops also? I wouldn't be surprised! HR 218 over rides it. You do not need a parachute to skydive. You only need a parachute to skydive twice.
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crazybastid83		#4	[url]	[-]
Posts: 4361 Dec 11 12 7:38 PM	Ask the ordinary non celebrity in NYC or NJ how it is working for them. Illinois will maybe eventually have a MAY issue permit.
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BROOM		#5	[url]	[-]
Posts: 9038 Dec 11 12 7:40 PM	HR 218 is for interstate carry. Illinois could prohibit ret cops since they are now civilians etc.
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Chicago PD NorthSide		#6	[url]	[-]
Posts: 250 Dec 11 12 8:25 PM	Be it here in Illinois or any of the other 49 states, HR 218 (with annual qualification required) permits retired CPD to carry concealed firearms. By the way, this topic is also covered on www .SecondCityCop.blogspot.com under the heading of "Illinois to Join the United States". I also note that in the final two pages of Judge Ann Williams dissent, she specifically cites New York City's draconian laws on concealed carry. At this time, I believe there is heavy traffic to the link of this decision. If you can't link now, try later. Please feel free to also post your opinions on the Second City Cop (SCC) blog. Generally, Chicago PD officers, both active and retired, hold the opinions of our NYPD colleagues with the utmost respect.
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10 More To Go		#7	[url]	[-]
Posts: 1783 Dec 11 12 8:33 PM	Northside, before HR 218, did Chicago prevent retired cops from carrying?
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Chicago PD NorthSide		#8	[url]	[-]
Posts: 250 Dec 11 12 8:49 PM	"10 More to Go" Check your mailbox.
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Chicago PD NorthSide		#9	[url]	[-]
Posts: 250 Dec 11 12 9:17 PM	In the event you are unable to link to this case, the masthead reads as follows: In the United States Court of Appeals For the Seventh Circuit ------------------------------------------------ Nos. 12-1269, 12-1788 MICHAEL MOORE, et al., and MARY E. SHEPARD, et al., Plaintiffs-Appellants, v. LISA MADIGAN, ATTORNEY GENERAL OF ILLINOIS, et al., Defendants-Appellees * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * I believe that "crazybastid83" and "5and OUT" are referring to the conflict with the November 27, 2012 decision of the 2nd Circuit Court of Appeals. See 11-3642: KACHALSKY, et al. v. COUNTY OF WESTCHESTER, et al. Edited 3 times by Chicago PD NorthSide Dec 12 12 10:32 AM.
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10 More To Go		#10	[url]	[-]
Posts: 1783 Dec 11 12 9:32 PM	Remove this ad Michael Moore as the lead plaintiff? Cool.
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RetirementIsParole		#11	[url]	[-]
Posts: 9046 Dec 12 12 12:49 AM	BROOM wrote: HR 218 is for interstate carry. Illinois could prohibit ret cops since they are now civilians etc. Incorrect. HR218 permits "Qualified Retired LEOs" to carry regardless of state and local law. You fuckin' people... you have no idea how to defend a nation. All you did was weaken a country today Retirement is Parole REMEMBER CARDILLO Don't blame me, I voted for Palin Alas, they were Democrats, so they cheated lawmanbrooklyn wrote: Hopefully, my daugther would have the semen of many men on her sheets
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ryanpax		#12	[url]	[-]
Posts: 1002 Dec 12 12 6:18 AM	They are just going to play the game like they do here in NYC make it difficult and expensive to get a pistol permit or CCW. ‎"Human beings only have two ways to deal with one another: reason and force. If you want me to do something for you, you have a choice of either convincing me via argument, or force me to do your bidding under threat of force. Every human interaction falls into one of those two categories, without exception. Reason or force, that's it. " -Jiggs-
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Chicago PD NorthSide		#13	[url]	[-]
Posts: 250 Dec 12 12 9:57 PM	I read your recent 2nd Circuit decision of November 27, 2012 in No. 11-3642: KACHALSKY, et al. v. COUNTY OF WESTCHESTER, et al. It conflicts with our 7th Circuit decision which leads me to believe that within the alloted 180 days, the Democratic rat corksoakers in Illinois will craft a draconian law which effectively bars virtually every citizen from obtaining a concealed carry permit similar to NYC. If denied by the 7th Circuit, they will then file for a petition for a writ of certiorari to appeal before the U.S. Supreme Court. So who get the concealed carry permits in NYC? Just celebrity-types and multi-millionaires? Can a sane working stiff with no police record get a permit? Who decides "proper cause" and who gets approved or denied for a concealed carry permit in NYC?
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HAPD		#14	[url]	[-]
Posts: 5801 Dec 12 12 11:36 PM	Is Racoon Eyes gonna get with the law? How about your perhaps to be indicted Gov? "Give Me A Fast Ship For I Intend To Go In Harm's Way" During WWII no other Naval Unit eclipsed the record of the Little Beavers lead by Captain "31 Knot Arleigh Burke." There are Sailors and there are DESTROYER SAILORS. Fast sleek they seek out the enemy to engage at point blank range. "Neptune was God, Mahan his prophet, and the United States Navy the only true Church"
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ryanpax		#15	[url]	[-]
Posts: 1002 Dec 12 12 11:39 PM	Basically the only people who get full concealed carry permits in NYC are: 1) Celebs and people who are politically connected 2) Retired law enforcement officers 3) " Some" security guards ( Those who protect well connected people) Other than that unless youre a retired LEO. You get special restricted permits that are A) Carry guard B) Special Patrolman carry C) residence permit D) Business only carry permit. You will have to jump through hoops and play alot of games before they give you your permit. The process is designed to purposely discourage, annoy, and place every obstacle in your way before the city begrudgingly issues you a pistol permit and that is if you are lucky enough that they do not find a reason to arbitrarily and capriciously deny you a permit for any reason from missing paperwork to getting fired from a job you ha d many years ago. ‎"Human beings only have two ways to deal with one another: reason and force. If you want me to do something for you, you have a choice of either convincing me via argument, or force me to do your bidding under threat of force. Every human interaction falls into one of those two categories, without exception. Reason or force, that's it. " -Jiggs- Edited 1 time by ryanpax Dec 13 12 4:54 AM.
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Chicago PD NorthSide		#16	[url]	[-]
Posts: 250 Dec 13 12 1:34 PM	I really appreciate NYPD ranters insights into the concealed carry ban outside the home in Illinois. Knowing the shameless political corruption and diabolical bent of local Democratic politicians and in light of the recent decisions from both the 7th and 2nd Circuit Courts of Appeals, the response of the State of Illinois is predictable. They will begrudgingly comply with the 7th Circuit's 180-day deadline to craft preposterous legislation not unlike the draconian laws which adversely affect the decent, law-abiding citizens of New York City who wish to carry a concealed handgun outside their homes for the sole purpose of self-defense. While it will be state law, I wouldn't be shocked if they included an even more draconian proviso for any Illinois city "with a population in excess of one million" (Why don't they just say "Chicago"). Incidentally, Judge Ann Williams, the lone dissenter in 7th Circuit decision, cites New York City concealed carry on the last two pages of the ruling. As "ryanpax" ("...jump through hoops...") noted, the law will make it virtually impossible for an apolitical, sane and decent law-abiding citizen to obtain a concealed carry permit. CLOUT and political patronage (which can include ca$h "campaign contributions" ) will determine who receives concealed carry permits. To the law-abiding working stiffs who reside in Chicago's Englewood or Garfield Park neighborhoods (think Brownsville and East New York as comparable) who are most likely to become unarmed victims of violent crime: FUGGEDABOUDIT! Only "generous" politically-connected citizens need apply. In the event that the new Illinois law does not pass muster with the 7th Circuit, Attorney General Lisa Madigan (who just happens to be the daughter of Chicago Democrat Michael Madigan, the most politically powerful official in the Illinois legislature) will petition to the SCOTUS for a writ of certiorari, citing the conflict between the 7th Circuit decision and the 2nd Circuit in No. 11-3642: KACHALSKY, et al. v. COUNTY OF WESTCHESTER, et al. This is just another facet of "THE Chicago Way" where you must "pay to play". QUESTIONS: What individual(s) decide which (exclude HR 218) New York City citizens are granted permits for concealed carry outside the home? Is it determined at respective borough (county) or a city wide level? According to the U.S. census, there are approximately 8.2 million New York City residents. How many of these NYC residents hold permits for concealed carry outside the home? Are there exorbitant fees? Can anyone cite documentation for laws/rules that apply to NYC concealed carry outside the home? P.S.: "ryanpax" and "10 More To Go": Please check your mailboxes. Edited 1 time by Chicago PD NorthSide Dec 14 12 12:31 PM.
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TrueBlue		#17	[url]	[-]
Posts: 7764 Dec 13 12 1:55 PM	Florida is about to issue its One Millionth concealed weapons permit. http://www.firstcoastnews.com/topstories/article/286931/483/Florida-to-hit-its-one-millionth-concealed-weapons-permit-next-week
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5andOUT		#18	[url]	[-]
Posts: 6137 Dec 13 12 2:16 PM	Chicago PD NorthSide wrote: I really appreciate NYPD ranters insights into the concealed carry ban outside the home in Illinois. Knowing the shameless political corruption and diabolical bent of local Democratic politicians and in light of the recent decisions from both the 7th and 2nd Circuit Courts of Appeals, the response of the State of Illinois is predictable. They will begrudgingly comply with the 7th Circuit's 180-day deadline to craft preposterous legislation not unlike the draconian laws which adversely affect the decent, law-abiding citizens of New York City who wish to carry a concealed handgun outside their homes for the sole purpose of self-defense. While it will be state law, I wouldn't be shocked if they included an even more draconian proviso for any Illinois city "with a population in excess of one million" (Why don't they just say "Chicago"). Incidentally, Judge Ann Williams, the lone dissenter in 7th Circuit decision, cites New York City concealed carry on the last two pages of the ruling. As "ryanpax" ("...jump through hoops...") noted, the law will make it virtually impossible for an apolitical, sane and decent law-abiding citizen to obtain a concealed carry permit. CLOUT and political patronage (which can include cash "campaign contributions" ) will determine who receives concealed carry permits. To the law-abiding working stiffs who reside in Chicago's Englewood or Garfield Park neighborhoods (think Brownsville and East New York as comparable) who are most likely to become unarmed victims of violent crime: FUGGEDABOUDIT! Only "generous" politically-connected citizens need apply. In the event that the new Illinois law does not pass muster with the 7th Circuit, Attorney General Lisa Madigan (who just happens to be the daughter of Chicago Democrat Michael Madigan, the most politically powerful official in the Illinois legislature) will petition to the SCOTUS for a writ of certiorari, citing the conflict between the 7th Circuit decision and the 2nd Circuit in No. 11-3642: KACHALSKY, et al. v. COUNTY OF WESTCHESTER, et al. This is just another facet of "THE Chicago Way" where you must "pay to play". QUESTIONS: What individual(s) decide which (exclude HR 218) New York City citizens are granted permits for concealed carry outside the home? Is it determined at respective borough (county) or a city wide level? According to the U.S. census, there are approximately 8.2 million New York City residents. How many of these NYC residents hold permits for concealed carry outside the home? Are there exorbitant fees? Can anyone cite documentation for laws/rules that apply to NYC concealed carry outside the home? P.S.: "ryanpax" and "10 More To Go": Please check your mailboxes. The issuance of permits in NYC, Nassau and Suffolk Counties is within the sole discretion of the Police Commissioner. The Courts have almost exclusively upheld that discretion. Within NYC, there are no "civilian" carry permits - the ordinary people get a "premises" permit that does allow them to take the gun to a range within the City, or hunting with a hunting license and permission. Nassau and Suffolk issue a State Carry permit, but it is restricted to and from range and while hunting. The restrictions have been upheld, although they are not a part of State Law. ONLY retired LEOs and connected people get full carry permits. Even security guards are generally restricted to WHILE WORKING, and to and from only. Upstate Judges issue permits, so the rules can vary from County to County. State permits are not valid in NYC, however a NYC permit is valid throughout the State. A State permit issued upstate without restrictions is valid in Nassau County, even though the same permit issued in Nassau County is not valid for full carry in Nassau County. So far the courts have refused to properly address these issues. Retired Police Officer with a County permit are valid in NYC. Retired Peace Officers with a County permit have to obtain a separate NYC permit, which is granted on the spot for no fee other than the FBI fingerprint fee. The two decisions are in direct conflict, and I have no doubt the issue will wind up in the Supreme Court. Hopefully none of the conservative justices will die before then. You do not need a parachute to skydive. You only need a parachute to skydive twice.
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10 More To Go		#19	[url]	[-]
Posts: 1783 Dec 13 12 4:40 PM	Chicago PD NorthSide wrote: QUESTIONS: What individual(s) decide which (exclude HR 218) New York City citizens are granted permits for concealed carry outside the home? Is it determined at respective borough (county) or a city wide level? According to the U.S. census, there are approximately 8.2 million New York City residents. How many of these NYC residents hold permits for concealed carry outside the home? Are there exorbitant fees? Can anyone cite documentation for laws/rules that apply to NYC concealed carry outside the home? As 5andOUT said, in the 5 counties of New York City (we are the only US city that has multiple counties that I know of) permits are issued by the Police Commissioner. The PC serves at the pleasure of the Mayor, so it's really up to the Mayor. Fees: For all Counties in New York State that are outside of NYC, it costs $10 for a permit. Inside NYC it costs $340. Yeah, I'd call it exorbitant and Unconstitutional. The Second Amendment Foundation is filing a lawsuit called Kwong vs. Bloomberg. Documentation required: Plenty. The application is 16 pages long. http://www.nyc.gov/html/nypd/downloads/pdf/permits/HandGunLicenseApplicationFormsComplete.pdf Oh, the lead defendant in the Illinois case, Michael Moore, retired as a Correction Officer after 30 years of service and was allowed to carry off-duty. That right was taken away from him when he retired. He is currently the Superintendent of the Champaign County Jail. It's a civilian position, so he can't get a permit. Even though he's obviously a potential target of violent felons. Yeah, that sounds like 'reasonable gun control laws' to me.
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5andOUT		#20	[url]	[-]
Posts: 6137 Dec 13 12 4:47 PM	Remove this ad What I found interesting is that NYPD wanted a notarized letter from my wife allowing me to have a gun. When I went to 1PP, the nice person there did not even take the letter. She said: "After 30 years OTJ, I think your wife probably knows you have a gun". But where in the Constitution does it permit your wife to waive your Constitutional rights? I must have missed that section. You do not need a parachute to skydive. You only need a parachute to skydive twice.
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Illinois Concealed Carry Ban Overturned by 7th Circuit

Illinois Concealed Carry Ban Overturned by 7th Circuit